I went to Codeplex to see about updating Pyjama [1] to use the latest
IronPython and IronRuby, but had some issues:

1) There are only two downloads for 2.7: msi and a zip of binaries.
Shouldn't there be a zip of sources? Or a note how how to get them?

2) I tried the zipped binaries on Mono 2.6.7 under Ubuntu 10.10, but
that doesn't look like it is supported:

$ mono ipy.exe
WARNING: The runtime version supported by this application is unavailable.
Using default runtime: v1.1.4322
** (ipy.exe:11466): WARNING **: Missing method
System.Environment::SetEnvironmentVariable(string,string) in assembly
/usr/lib/mono/1.0/mscorlib.dll, referenced in assembly
/home/dblank/Desktop/IronPython-2.7/ipy.exe
Unhandled Exception: System.MissingMethodException: Method not found:
'System.Environment.SetEnvironmentVariable'.

3) Looked in Source Code; found a zip, but it is 180 MB. Is that all
of svn? How do I get just 2.7?

4) Tried "svn co https://IronPython.svn.codeplex.com/svn/IronPython_Main
IronPython2.7"... but not sure what this is... it has *some* Ruby
things. How do I build IronRuby and IronPython that use the same DLR
parts?

5) Can I use Mono 2.6.7 to build IronPython 2.7? How? I tried "xbuild"
in the Solutions dir, but only errors.

Thanks for any help on building (or getting) IronPython2.7 for Mono.

-Doug

[1]  http://PyjamaProject.org/

I've just been through the same thing. Stop where you are and wait until I
send more information. The short answer is : you cannot build IPy on a stock
Ubuntu or Debian system. I just got a lead on a way to install mono 2.10
beside the stock 2.6.3. If you attempt to replace the patched Debian mono
you will break your Ubuntu system. I just did that. Will get back to you as
soon asI get to a real computer.

Vernon Cole
(sent from my 'droid phone)

I went to Codeplex to see about updating Pyjama [1] to use the latest
IronPython and IronRuby, but had some issues:

1) There are only two downloads for 2.7: msi and a zip of binaries.
Shouldn't there be a zip of sources? Or a note how how to get them?

2) I tried the zipped binaries on Mono 2.6.7 under Ubuntu 10.10, but
that doesn't look like it is supported:

$ mono ipy.exe
WARNING: The runtime version supported by this application is unavailable.
Using default runtime: v1.1.4322
** (ipy.exe:11466): WARNING **: Missing method
System.Environment::SetEnvironmentVariable(string,string) in assembly
/usr/lib/mono/1.0/mscorlib.dll, referenced in assembly
/home/dblank/Desktop/IronPython-2.7/ipy.exe
Unhandled Exception: System.MissingMethodException: Method not found:
'System.Environment.SetEnvironmentVariable'.

3) Looked in Source Code; found a zip, but it is 180 MB. Is that all
of svn? How do I get just 2.7?

4) Tried "svn co https://IronPython.svn.codeplex.com/svn/IronPython_Main
IronPython2.7"... but not sure what this is... it has *some* Ruby
things. How do I build IronRuby and IronPython that use the same DLR
parts?

5) Can I use Mono 2.6.7 to build IronPython 2.7? How? I tried "xbuild"
in the Solutions dir, but only errors.

Thanks for any help on building (or getting) IronPython2.7 for Mono.

-Doug

[1]  http://PyjamaProject.org/

Hi, Doug,

IronPython 2.7 and newer seem to need at least .NET 4.0, which needs at
least Mono 2.8.

Best regards

Markus Schaber

Is that you need Mono 2.8 to build IronPython, or to run it?
IronPython2.6 beta 2 is running fine under Mono 2.6.7.

-Doug

As far as I can see, you need .NET 4 / Mono 2.8 for both compiling and
running.

IronPython 2.6.2 is delivered in two versions, one for .NET 4 and the
other one for .NET 2 (but using some C# 3 language features).

The main difference seems to be in the DLR libraries used, parts of it
have been integrated into the core libraries in .NET 4, so they are not
compatible between versions.

Best regards

Markus Schaber

IronPython 2.7 requires .NET 4 (to build and run). Mono 2.10 is
probably your best bet.

- Jeff

Is there a place on IronPython's codeplex site that we could document
this information?

Currently, there are many assumptions on:

http://ironpython.codeplex.com/wikipage?title=Respository%20[..] http://ironpython.codeplex.com/wikipage?title=Contributing%2[..]

that suggest that IronPython requires Visual Studio, Windows, etc. I
guess those wiki pages can't be edited by anyone, but if you make a
page off of those, I'd be glad to help maintain this alternate build
and run information. My codeplex id is dsblank.

-Doug

Yes, yes there should. D'oh.

https://github.com/IronLanguages/main/zipball/ipy-2.7

It's fairly big, though, as it's just a package of the git repo. Is
there a ton of value in having smaller zip packages? The download
numbers on them have always been fairly low, so they were dropped for
2.7 in favour of github's automatic zip generation.

The main source is now on  https://github.com/ironlanguages/main.  I'm
thinking of removing the source tab from CodePlex to avoid confusion,
if that's possible.

- Jeff

You now have "Editor" permission and should be able to edit the wiki
to your heart's content. Mono docs would be awesome.

There does need to be a strategy around docs, though. They're really
scattered right now, between codeplex, github, and the source. And
most of them aren't on the websites either. I just don't have a
concrete idea yet about how to deal with that.

- Jeff

docs.ironpython.net?

Might I suggest sphinx-quickstart as the first command to run.

That's kinda what I'm leaning towards, preferably hosted on
readthedocs.com. Most of the docs are already ReST so using sphinx
should be easy. As always, it's just a matter of time, and after
watching Jacob Kaplan-Moss at PyCon, I feel really bad about the state
of our docs right now.

- Jeff

Correct!  IronPython 2.6.2 will work ALMOST correctly on Ubuntu 10.10,
IF you use the binary which is linked for .NET 2.0.  The error I
experienced is that the black typeface on the default Gnome Terminal
(with a white background) turns to light grey when IPy starts.  If you
switch Gnome Terminal to the black background, all is well.  I assume
that change happened after 2.6.b2.

The version of mono is a more interesting story.  (Bear with me, I
spent a lot of time last week learning this.)  Ubuntu has made the
corporate decision to go with mono as part of their core. Ubuntu will
not work without mono, and about 40 supported applications (they tell
me) use mono. This is great news for the mono people, IMHO.  But it
comes with a cost.  Mono is created on a Redhat-like system, SUSE.
This is easy to understand, since the core group lives at Novell, the
sponsor of SUSE.  It seems that Redhat/SUSE have diverged enough from
Debian that a significant amount of patching is required to make the
stock (SUSE) release of mono work correctly on Debian.

[An explanation for Windows users still following along: Ubuntu is a
derivative of Debian, and uses most of the some packages. It has a
MUCH faster release cycle, which I why I, and many others, use and
prefer it. I attended my first meeting of the Utah Python Users Group
last week and took a quick informal survey of the laptops present.
Ubuntu:20.5, OS/X:2, other Linux:0, Windows:0.5. This in a place where
lots of people work or worked for Novell, and the general population
of programmers is heavily invested in Microsoft. The .5 is my (dual
boot) laptop.]

The Debian maintainers apply their patches to the LTS [long term
support] version of mono, which at this point is 2.6.3.  One of the
Debian mono maintainers has supplied a patched 2.10 mono as a PPA on
launchpad, but he only supports LTS versions of Ubuntu, which 10.10 is
not.  Therefore, the newest (i.e. .NET 4) software will not run on the
newest Ubuntu. A very frustrating paradox.

I received several suggestions about how to get around this problem,
most of them involving virtual machines, or sandboxes.  Since Redhat
and SUSE are not as heavily invested in mono, they run more current
versions. The latest suggestion, which I must rebuild my Linux
partition before I can test, is this:
v v v v v v v
from    Christopher James Halse Rogers <raof*******>
sender-time    Sent at 7:24 PM (GMT+11:00). Current time there: 2:27 AM. ✆
to    Vernon Cole <vernondcole*******>
cc    ubuntu-devel-discuss*******
subject    Re: IronPython and Mono are very old. How can we get an update?
[...snip...]    
Hm.  I should have linked  http://apebox.org/wordpress/linux/370/  which
is a description of how to do a parallel mono install in a way that
works with the Debian CLI policy and tools.
^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^
===========================  NEW SUBJECT =================================

The current source of IronPython is not on codeplex!
(and the documentation on codeplex has not yet been updated to reflect
the change.  Real soon now...)

The current source is on github. On Ubuntu, the download of the source
is a snap. [Windows users, eat your heart out.]
Having already registered an ssl key with github, I do this:
v v v v
vernon@dlc-ubuntu:~$ sudo apt-get install bzr-git
vernon*******/IronLanguages/main
^ ^ ^ ^
Which gives me a lovely, user friendly, bazaar repository.
--
Vernon

Thanks! My codeplex ID is the same as my google ID: vernondcole
(on sourceforge I confuse people by using my amateur radio call "kf7xm")
-- P.S.
I misstated the version number of LTS mono in my recent epistle.
It is 2.6.7-3.
--
Vernon

Users mailing list
Users*******

Thanks, Vernon, for this useful information. Some additional comments below:

I'm not too concerned about ipy.exe itself, but about being about to
use the dlls.

I'm trying to verify that the IronPython 2.7 dlls absolutely need Mono
2.8 or later. If that is true, I'll have to stay with IronPython 2.6
until the rest of the Linux distros catch up (or I make my own version
of Mono to download). Perhaps Miguel or someone from SuSE can add more
details to the dependencies for building and running IronPython 2.7?

andrew recently was talking about RPM build scripts on this list, but
I never heard a follow-up regarding if that information was being
shared:

Perhaps that is a way forward?

FYI, the latest LTS Ubuntu is 10.04. Which means (I think) that the
next LTS Ubuntu is due in 2012 (12.04). (Vernon corrected in separate
email the point that Ubuntu is shipping with Mono 2.6.7 as the current
version.)

I need a solution for general installs. Perhaps a stand-alone Mono
2.10 install will work, if I can't build IronPython 2.7 on Mono 2.10,
and then run with Mono 2.6.7...

-Doug

IronPython 2.7 *should* build for .NET 2.0, although it's not the
default (I don't remember the name of the MSBuild configuration to do
so, though). However, I don't think that was consistently tested, so I
don't know if it works. I would consider it not working a bug, though.

We won't provide binaries for 2.7/.NET2, but we don't want to prevent
someone building their own either. 3.0, however, will drop support for
.NET 2 entirely.

- Jeff

I think that the  http://apebox.org/wordpress/linux/370/  link will end
up being the solution.
I just looked at it. It is written by Jo Shields (directhex), who is a
member of the Debian mono team, IIUC.

Among other useful things, he says: "This guide does NOT take startup
scripts into account =96 it=92s your problem to ensure you=92re using the
correct “mono” command to run your copy of MonoDevelop or Tomboy or
whatever."

The good news is: we may have an answer for that.  I have in my
possession a pre-release copy of an as-yet unnumbered PEP by Mark
Hammond. Mark is going to propose a python launcher program for
Windows, so that it will obey a "shebang" command to launch one of
multiple versions of python.

I proposed that IronPython launching ability should be included in it.
The reference code he supplies is in Python, and quite simple.

It would not be hard to make an Ubuntu version of a similar program,
to check for and launch the appropriate version of mono and IPy.
--
Vernon

I read that (and the comments) and it is very useful.

It seems that this is a common problem for many of us using Mono
cross-platform, as today on another mailing list a note was sent about
the same ideas:

http://chrismarinos.com/f-on-ubuntu-linux-with-mono-and-mono[..]

This version has a script for moving between mono versions, and the
first link has a method for falling back to the standard, I think.

Cool!

-Doug

Since you're already hosted on github, you can also just use their
gh-pages feature to host the documentation. See http://pages.github.com/  for more information. In particular note:

    "As of December 27, 2009, you can completely opt-out of Jekyll
    processing by creating a file named .nojekyll in the root of your
    pages repo and pushing that to GitHub. This should only be necessary
    if your site uses directories that begin with an underscore, as
    Jekyll sees these as special dirs and does not copy them to the
    final destination."

You'll probably have to do this since by default, Sphinx *does*
generate directories that start with an underscore. Once you create a
gh-pages branch and push your HTML to it, the documentation will show
up at  http://IronLanguages.github.com/main/.

          -- TP